Protocol specification - Bitmessage Wiki

Bitmarkets - Private Decentralized Marketplaces

[link]

Private by design decentralized p2p marketplace

Hi fellas, this is my first ever post on privacy.
I recently wrote about the existence of an open source DLT-based decentralized marketplace with a mission to enable free and private trade of goods and services. The marketplace description was posted on another subreddit but I think it's worth posting the description here too. Tbh I cant think of anything that qualifies more as "The intersection of technology, privacy, and freedom in a digital world"
I hope my own description of the marketplace and its technology bellow will fuel your interest to read more about it. My even bigger hope is that some of you will decide to become first-hand beta testers as soon as the upcoming v3.0 of the marketplace hits the testnet (eta: a few weeks).
You can also use the existing version (currently 2.3.5) of the marketplace to buy or sell products on the publicly accessible single community market there (or just play with it).
The marketplace:
It is called the Particl Marketplace and its ground breaking V3.0 is set to be released after 3 years of hard development work. The V3.0 will be the first version aimed at a wider public (normies and not only tech geeks). It will allow anyone to create easily decentralized personal storefronts or community markets or simply buy/sell goods on existing markets. The user-created markets/storefronts on the marketplace can be public if the access key is publicly announced on the Particl network or absolutely invisible to anyone that doesn’t know the access key (held by the creator). This is an intentional privacy feature and simply put, if you dont have the market access key (essentially a decryption key) there is absolutely no way to see/detect that some market exists.
The marketplace is private by design and decentralized, with no middlemen or intermediaries whatsoever. The trades are protected by a two-way automated escrow via smart-contracts that de-incentivize and penalize dishonest behavior on both sides. In particular, the buy-flow forces the buyer to deposit 1x item value + payment and the seller 1x item value (+ sends item) into a common smart contract. If the buyer receives the product/service and its all good, then he unlocks the escrow so both can get their 1x item value deposits back and the seller receive his payment.
The marketplace takes no sales commissions from the storefronts/markets and charges only a tiny listing fee (<0.01$) to prevent product listings spamming. All the marketplace generated fees go to the staking nodes that provide the hardware infrastructure for the p2p network to operate. The network nodes can be public or you can run them as Tor hidden services.
The technology:
The Particl Marketplace is crypto-agnostic and currently supports payments in BTC, PART, ZCoin (XMR, DAI, NIX, USDC, USDT are next in the pipeline and many more to come). It uses as a settlement layer its native coin PART and own blockchain, which is an up-to-date Bitcoin codebase with added privacy features like CT, RingCT (up to 32 mixins), Stealth addresses, etc. These privacy features are used in combination to keep the financial data, like escrows and transactions, private and most importantly un-linkable to the actual market buys/sells.
For the users and markets related data exchange like posted listings, buy/sell flows, encrypted user communication, built-in cryptocurrency exchange, etc, the marketplace uses a DSN, currently its a custom Bitmessage variant called SMSG, which allows metadata stripped encrypted p2p data exchange (no sender, no receiver)
Last but not least the marketplace desktop app (Particl Desktop) has a built-in option for using the Tor network via proxy.
The important people:
The cypherpunks behind Particl Marketplace have been OGs freedom advocates and pioneers in the privacy DLT field. For example, they were the first ever to implement features like RingCT, Bulletproofs, PoS, cold staking, etc on a Bitcoin codebase. Their privacy features implementations have been audited successfully by several respectable academics and security R&D providers, like QuarksLab.
The team behind the project has been so far focused on building without any marketing/awareness efforts and thus have remained intentionally in the shadows. The latter is planned to change with the v3.0 release. One of the steps towards that will be the initiation of several long-planned awareness campaigns, like the Vendor Onboarding and Outreach Program, the Particl Academy (an easy to understand and learn about the technology portal) and many more.
Me:
I am a passionate freedom and privacy advocate that discovered the project 1.5 year ago and since then has become a member of their small but like-minded community ([email protected]/discord).
My personal belief is that the Particl Marketplace provides a game-changing/breaking usecase to the world. At the minimum, due to the open source nature of the project, it will be a proof of concept that is bound to shift the global eCommerce paradigm.
submitted by Bakounin to privacy [link] [comments]

I'm ready to build a killer app for BCH but I could use some advice on how to make it as appealing to Satoshi's ideals as possible.

After some research and a lot of business meetings, I've made the first progress necessary to create a MVNO focused on Cryptocurrencies (possibly just Bitcoin Cash).
A MVNO is a mobile phone provider that exists on the network of another larger provider. Some of the biggest examples are Boost Mobile, Cricket Wireless, EasyGo Wireless, Freedom Pop, MetroPCS, StraightTalk, etc.
The 'coolest' plan would be pay-as-you-go where every minute of voice usage, every megabyte of data usage, and every txt is paid for with BCH as the resource is consumed.
The problem is that there are some opposing issues related to billing, Satoshi's guiding principals, business needs, and various optimizations across a wide variety of layers. I would love everyone's input in order to formulate the best plan of action that'll be good for the network and still be appealing to crypto enthusiasts.
Satoshi gave us guidance and ethos that suggests each individual should be their own bank, but I want to be able to enable a level of automation that will allow payments to work without user interaction. If I want to allow SIM cards to be used in IoT devices or in user-supplied phones, there shouldn't be a requirement for a specific payment app to be running in userspace anywhere.
Obviously, it wouldn't be ideal to generate multiple on-chain transactions every minute to deduct for usage. Payment channels were an initial thought, but they require the user to actually send increment a value and resign the unbroadcast transaction. It's not fair or practical to require a user to do this.
I could just create a deposit address for users to send funds to and credit an internal register but that's too old-school and doesn't go with the concept that the money isn't yours if you don't hold the private key. I don't want to be responsible for holding unspent user funds.
I think I've found a good balance.
When a customer first signs up (and pays for the SIM kit or optional mobile phone), they'll be sent a new SIM card and a wallet card with a private key QR code and 12 word mnemonic seed and a pubkey qr code to check the balance on the other side. When they transfer funds to the wallet on the card, it'll activate the service. We'll also have the private key and once the wallet is funded, we'll set up a payment channel from their wallet to the service wallet. Everytime we get a callback from the provider network indicating usage, we'll update the channel on behalf of the user to increment the charges. Ever 24 to 72 hours, we'll tear down the channel and settle the transactions and build up a new channel.
When the wallet starts running low on funds, the user will be sent a message asking them to top up. If the imported the private key into a wallet app, they can just transfer more funds in. If not, they can log into the web portal to see a deposit address to send funds to.
By co-managing the private wallet associated with the SIM, it also opens up some interesting potentials with easy fund transfers between phone numbers on the system.
I would love to get everyone's input before moving forward. It won't require an insane outlay of funds, but writing the billing infrastructure and API integrations will represent some significant work. I also want to enable features like pointing multiple SIMs to a single wallet, selling add-on services like VPN's, allowing for quick number changes, VoIP gateways, bitmessage to txt gateway, etc.
I would like your input. What would be something really cool you could do with this kind of mobile provider? What features would you love to see that nobody else has? What kind of price point would you expect? Do you like the idea of pay-as-you-go or would you rather have standard rate plans? What about more choices of cryptos for wallet reloading?
submitted by DeftNerd to btc [link] [comments]

The future of Bitcoin in an increasingly restricted world

I'm sure by now all of you have read https://medium.com/p/d5545bf0e2cb .
I reread the article yesterday, and I have thought a bit about its message. Here are my conclusions (in TLDR form), which I substantiate below, as free as you are to disagree with them:
I don't think Bitcoin is going to be dead, but rather that its usage may revert to the original purpose it was invented for.
What I am trying to say is that the real value proposition, the killer app of Bitcoin, the one intended by Satoshi himself, isn't low fees, nor speed of transactions, nor decentralized trust, but rather it is an engineering solution to a social problem. The problem is malevolent organized intervention attempts against people, who freely and consensually use their own money, according to their own criteria. The solution is to paralyze and bypass said intervention, decentralized trust being integral to that solution. What an evildoer can't see, he can't attack. Bitcoin delivers that killer app, like any other cypherpunk / cryptoanarchist technology (SSL, GPG, Bitmessage, Open Transactions) in the same category.
So how do I think Bitcoin usage will change? Well, to be able to predict what may happen with Bitcoin in the future, let's look at who wins and loses given this killer app, and their likely behaviors.
Let's start with the losers first.
Quite obviously, rulers of nations (defined here as people believed to have the exclusive power to make up rules for everyone else, to adjudicate the rules, and to enforce them) understand that people gaining control of their own money and paralyzing ruler intervention is a grave threat. In other words: such private control of money means they lose control over the money of their subjects.
We part-time slacker students of history also happen to know how they react to such systemic threats of loss of control, because we have seen what they have tried to do covertly (sabotage, rule violation) and overtly (rule making, rule bending) to subvert prior cypherpunk tech that affords more control to the end user, like SSL and PGP.
Now, comparing PGP to Bitcoin, Bitcoin is obviously more subversive a technology -- heck, it's not just stateless communications, it's stateless money -- so I expect these people to try sabotaging Bitcoin even more frantically.
I predict they will prescribe new, ever-more-restrictive orders against Bitcoin, until any and all use of Bitcoin will trigger a punishment, or at least be heavily surveiled to keep everyone "in the farm" so to speak. Most subjects will elect to "stay in the farm", abandon Bitcoin, and comply with the rulers.
OK, we've analyzed the losers. They lose. Now let's look at who wins.
It's a no-brainer that, if you know someone is spying on your Web browsing, and you are made aware of SSL, your use of SSL will likely go up, not down.
It's the same with money: facing increasing demands of control over how you may use your money or how much of it may you keep -- your use of a technology that protects your money from others taking it / spending it against your will, is likely to go up, not down.
In other words: I expect to see increased use of Bitcoin in the future, that is explicitly intended to disobey orders from rulers.
Bitcoin will undergo a process of evaporative cooling, where the mainstream speculators and obedient actors exit the market, leaving agorists, members of blue markets, people who intend to conduct business in flagrant disobedience while resisting attempts of punishment. Protected by already-known advances in anonymity (like stealth addresses), these many Bitcoin users will remain relatively safe from rulers' attacks against their prosperity and well-being. They will "step out of the farm", if you will.
Of course, this remaining group includes both bad actors (e.g. fraudsters) and good actors (people running honest businesses). This problem will be resolved by increased research in stateless reputation systems to protect everyone against fraudsters (which happened to work very well in the Silk Road, according to users' reports in the /SilkRoad subreddit).
In short, this leads me to believe that Bitcoin in the future will be primarily used by two groups of people:
In other words: rather than the future of "mainstream acceptance" that mainstream Bitcoin users envisioned, Bitcoin's future is increasingly looking like the mainstream's absolute worst nightmare: a niche independence tool for widespread yet invisible economic defiance and self-defense against the very orders that the mainstream can't even conceive to disobey. To take an example I have witnessed personally: if you sell copies of DVDs in the streets of Guayaquil, this tech is literally the difference between losing all your capital and your profits, versus only losing a few DVDs, at the hands of the street cops blatantly stealing your stuff.
You may think this is provincial. It really isn't. Given that the blue markets rival the "official economy" in size, and given that Bitcoin may offer a chance to secede quietly, safely, and privately to participate in the blue markets, the potential for Bitcoin and allied technologies like Open Transactions is enormous.
Of course, it could also be the case that the rulers succeed in putting the cat back in the bag, and manage to eliminate Bitcoin completely, or subvert it altogether. I will believe that is possible when they have eliminated BitTorrent. But, so far, I have only seen them act all keystone kops, stealing a few DVDs from street vendors, and the first world equivalent thereof (ruining middle class people).
Satoshi famously said: Bitcoin alone will not solve the problem of financial oligopoly, but I hope Bitcoin would buy us all some time in that struggle for freedom. I, for one, am stocking up on popcorn, to properly enjoy the slo-mo clash of these two worlds of ideas in the years to come. Heck, it is already very entertaining to witness today.
Reprinted at: http://rudd-o.com/archives/the-future-of-bitcoin-in-an-increasingly-restricted-world
submitted by throwaway-o to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Subspace: A new messaging protocol for bitcoin

A few weeks ago we saw a proposal from Thomas V at Electrum to use email for sending BIP70 payment requests.
I'd like to introduce you to a joint project between myself (bitcoinauthenticator.org) and the Open Bazaar dev team to develop a messaging protocol that is better suited for this purpose ― Subspace.
What is it?
A preliminary design for a lightweight asynchronous private messaging protocol.
You can read more about it on github.
And download a proof-of-concept anonymous messaging client built on the protocol from here.
What can we use it for?
Direct payments
Currently when we send bitcoin payments, the sender broadcasts the transaction to the bitcoin network with the recipient downloading it from the network.
One of the problems here is that while it's easy for lite clients upload a transaction to the network privately (using Tor), it's very difficult (if not impossible) for them to download their messages privately. A minority if wallets use either bloom or prefix filtering to obfuscate their downloads, but implementing it properly is very difficult and at present none do. Even then it's impossible to avoid privacy leaks in all situations.
By sending the payment directly to the recipient over another communication channel, the sender can upload it without blowing his privacy. (We still need to query for block inclusion, but this can be done as a one off).
Some of you may know that this was Satoshi's original vision. Version 0.1 had a pay-to-IP address protocol that sent transactions directly to the recipient with the recipeint's client uploading it. The goal is to do that here, but using a fully encrypted, private, communication channel. Because it's using ECDH, you could easily use the same (stealth) address that you use to receive bitcoins to receive payment messages (or any kind of message for that matter).
BIP70 Payment Requests
The payment protocol is currently only used for merchant-consumer transactions, but we should be able to send payment requests from person to person.
Furthermore, BIP70 is currently a "pull" model, where your wallet downloads the payment request only after clicking a link or scanning a QR. Using this protocol, we could "push" payment requests to users and enable monthly billing and various other services.
Attaching private messages to transactions
There isn't any way to do this with person to person transactions at present. You could stick a message for the recipient in OP_RETURN (not recommended) but it would be publicly visible for everyone to see. With subspace we can do this easily.
Coinjoin
There are only two coinjoin implementations at present and both are running on independent servers. Ideally we shouldn't be segregating coinjoin participants by server. It makes the pool of participants smaller, leading to less robust mixing and longer mix times. Since subspace allows for real time communication, we could run protocol like coinjoin over it. (On a related note I've had a number of conversations with Tim Ruffing, author of the coinshuffle paper, and the one thing it's been missing is an appropriate communication channel).
And finally Open Bazaar has quite a few use cases ― Ricardian contract hosting, multiparty communication (buyer, merchant, notary), market channels, haggling, etc.
Why not use bitmessage for all this?
This question is inevitable. That would be ideal, unfortunately bitmessage has some design properties that make it ill-suited for most of these use cases.
The biggest issue is the proof-of-work. Currently bitcoin transactions go through in less than a second. With bitmessage it would take 2-3 minutes and you would kill your battery on mobile. The UX would be so poor no one would use it.
Coinjoin is another one. You need real time communication to make it work or else transactions would take an hour and likely never complete as parties would just drop out.
Also, bitmessage has scalability issues. It requires all clients to store all messages despite there being no consensus requirement (like in bitcoin) that would necessitate it. And since it's basically a network of volunteers, it has to use POW as a somewhat awkward hack to ration disk space.
In subspace, messages are only required to be stored by the node to which they were uploaded (others can voluntarily download and store for redundancy, but it isn't a requirement). This allows us to ration disk space without proof-of-work by using quota or charging (in bitcoin) for storage.
And finally bitmessage is heavyweight protocol, unsuitable for lite clients. Subspace is designed exclusively for lite clients (with prefix filtering for user defined anonymity sets) and is easy to implement.
So to answer the question... it offers the same amount of privacy, but it's lighter, faster, more scalable, and easier to implement. All around better suited for the use cases outlined above.
Where we go from here?
Everything above is very preliminary. Nothing is set in stone and we would certainly appreciate feedback. I've already received some good technical feedback from Mike Hearn, and we would welcome more.
On the client... keep in mind I wrote that in about a week's worth of work. Hence, you probably shouldn't use it for anything that definitely needs to be kept secret as there is likely to be bugs.
But it seems to be working well otherwise. It connects over Tor automatically and every message is routed through a different exit node. If it's something this community values, more time could be invested in it. It also would be pretty easy to throw on Android if someone wanted to do that.
If you would like to help out, check it out on github. There is more work to do on the network side before it's fully functional.
Cheers
submitted by Chris_Pacia to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

"Code is Law": Comedy Gold Survey on Ethereum

Survey ID: 00001 Coin: Ethereum Client: Tyler Durden

Executive summary:

Ethereum is almost certainly the number 2 coin in comedy gold. It will likely surpass Bitcoin in comedy gold long before it passes it in market cap. Thanks in large part to a spam-based marketing campaign on Reddit, it also has a dedicated base of critics.
After its IPO, it was known as “Inthereum” for a while, infinitely powerful of course, as vaporware can do anything. It had a major version release, then another. Finally, a major smart contract, in terms of valuation, came along: The DAO. Not to be confused with other DAOs, before and after. The DAO was the biggest. It was going to be the best; it already was the best! Euphoria was off the charts.
Until just a few months in, a bug was found. And the killer app became the flash point. What could they do? Well, hard fork and give the money back, of course! And so they did.
“Code is Law”; but this is actually good for Ethereum because “[a]lthough some do question the analogy ‘code is law’. I do not. We just found out that we have a supreme court, the community!” [1]
After the D'OH, Ethereum struggles to top its ATH comedy gold, but there is still a bright future for popcorn and comedy gold from Ethereum.

5 Largest Veins of Comedy Gold

Here are the largest comedy gold veins in Ethereum in potential reserves in our estimation in approximately descending order:
  • Cultlike euphoria - Now, this can certainly be said to be common to almost all cryptocurrencies. But Ethereum seems special here, even more than Bitcoin's community. There is a real belief here that this coin is going to change the world. This helps play into a "this is very good for Ethereum" mindset, wherein even the D'OH fork was a great success!
There is no greater terror than a fiend on ether.
  • Vitalik Buterin - The best name in cryptocurrency! Young genius central to Ethereum and almost universally seen as the most important leader in the project. In our view, his endorsement and leadership during the D'OH fork led to that route being taken. That is, we believe if he had opposed it from the start, he may have been able to prevent it or at least have led to what is now called ETC being the dominant of the two.
And so in our view, Mr. Buterin runs a billion dollar cryptocurrency right now. He and his team seem to have done reasonably well so far; it seems likely they'll continue to thrive. To the best of my knowledge, confirmed on /ethereum, there hasn't been a drug market implemented in Ethereum or trading with ETH so far. But while it seems like a terrible idea, because of the lack of privacy and proven mutability of contracts, it seems like eventually there's going to be a major drug market accepting ETH just because it has such a high value. And, they point out, monero and zcoin’s core privacy feature will apparently be available on ETH after this next fork, so look forward to anonymous ETH fueling drug markets!
And then the interesting question will be raised of how Chief Justice Buterin will rule on the case, whether it is worthy of an intervention or not. If not a drug market, then another buggy and hacked contract. Or a hacked exchange, and the question of whether to make it or its users whole, or "let the hacker win".
  • DAOs - From the beginning, it was proposed that Ethereum itself and its reserve fund would be turned into a DAO. How exactly this was going to happen would be figured out later of course. There was an initial estimate of 2016 for the transition.
Of course, in 2016, The DAO and the D'OH happened. I'm not aware of a current further push to put all of ETH's future funding into a DAO. But I'm sure the topic will resurface. And it will be hilarious on so many levels. The DAO actually collapsed too soon for peak comedy gold extraction. It had been predicted that there would be no consensus on any proposals and that nothing would be funded, and that there would be gold from that. But it was just a few months in when the bug was found. And while the D'OH fork was certainly a rich vein of comedy gold, it wasn't as rich as what the DAO could have been if it had floundered around for a year or so before the hack.
Surprisingly, there's actually a running, apparently working DAO on ETH that was started even before The DAO: digixDAO. If it keeps on running, it will continue to be hilarious as other DAOs fail to learn from it. If it fails, there's all the more hilarity for Ethereum, making it the platform where anything complicated enough to look like an original use case will break. The very existence of digix is proof-of-comedy-gold.
  • Immutability - The whole central notion of immutability is going to be a recurring question for Ethereum after the D'OH. While there was a lot of sentiment of "just this once and never again" at the time, there will someday be another major issue, and the precedent will mean that at least a major debate among the community will be had. Ethereum is "mostly immutable". Bitcoin is far better protected here, because while it's true they've hard forked to fix a bug before, that was years ago and the community is far more fractured now. Ethereum has a demonstrated capacity to do both routine and controversial hard forks. This strength is also a challenge, as it will invite constant legal and ethical questions about when it's appropriate to modify the chain itself with a fork: that is, rolling back some or all transactions after major bugs, thefts, frauds, and so forth.
  • Concentration of funds - This one I'm just guessing at. Although rich lists do exist, obviously one entity like an exchange could pool funds in an address without one person owning that much, or one person could splits their coins among many accounts. But it gives a rough guide. In Bitcoin, the top 113 addresses, having more than 10,000 BTC, in total are 17.46% of the current supply [ 2 ]. And in Ethereum, it's true that the top two accounts are marked as exchange accounts [ 3 ]. Still, having lots of funds concentrated in a single exchange wallet seems to still have some potential for comedy gold. In Ethereum, the top 50 addresses have more than double the proportion of the top 113 in Bitcoin, a bit over 40% of the current supply. My guess would be there are still a lot of people who invested heavily in the initial ICO who have held onto a significant portion of their initial ETH. While some of these top addresses are exchanges, I think there are probably many individuals represented in here as well, and every one of them is a multimillionaire from this account alone.
Of course, so far, because ETH is still smaller than BTC in overall market cap, these top addresses aren't as huge as the top addresses in Bitcoin in current market value. But if ETH were to overtake BTC's current position with a relatively unchanged distribution, there would be some real comedy gold coming off this factor. Cribs could have a spin-off Ethereum series.
This concentration was a part of making The D'OH what it was in my view as well: in Bitcoin, there would never have been so much of the coin tied up in one particular venture, at least not now. But in Ethereum, this concentration and groupthink can combine to hilarious effect.

A Brief History of Comedy Gold in Ethereum:

“Laws, like sausages, cease to inspire respect in proportion as we know how they are made” - John Godfrey Saxe
In the beginning, there was an offering. The greatest coin the world had ever seen; step right up and buy it! There was even code; this is no vaporware! Sure, there was more work to be done, but the ICO would fund that work, the founders would get a little, and create a reserve for the future and the rest would be mineable.
There was also some of the most vociferous objections on BCT, declaring that the stake allocated to the founders was too large, pointing to other coins which had done smaller or done without. Arguing against the reserve; arguing against having a presale at all. Some people, of course, completely failing to read the documentation accurately to see what was even being proposed. And an almost complete radio silence from this large team working around the clock on Ethereum.
It took some months from when the initial ANN was made until the sale actually started, but by the time they had their sale, they had perhaps the best documentation at launch to-date. Of course, there were some areas which seemed to lack some detail, like the budgeting, but never mind that, it was finally launching!
Launching the sale, at least. In July and August of 2014, Ether was first sold. It was described as “fuel” for the virtual machine they were going to build [ 4 ].
And then, a year later, Ethereum was released live. By July 2016, it had already had its first major crisis after The DAO was hacked and the D’OH fork introduced in response.
But the fact that Ethereum was ever released, and that it was released so quickly, is truly incredible. There was more than one person who thought that the stated goals of Ethereum were not possible. And, of course, many initial goals and deadlines didn’t happen. But unlike the railbirds on BCT were convinced, the team did not fail nor did it run off with the money. They were given a blank check, and they actually delivered a working product which has been successful so far financially.
Of course, having its flagship smart contract go belly-up quite so quickly after having finally gotten a “killer app” seems rather unfortunate. The oracle problem (the question of how to reliably relate smart contracts to the outside world) seems unresolved, but partial solutions are inevitable and can only serve to make increasingly complex and thus popcorn-loaded contracts possible.
Right now, all seems relatively quiet. But rest assured, there remains plenty of euphoria and gas to drive many more cycles of comedy gold production. Ether huffers need something to throw their ETH at. The more complicated; the better! Given some of the creations that have been made in NXT, for instance, a few more years of creativity on ETH should yield some very complicated and pop-corn rich smart contracts.

Researcher’s Narrative:

I was relaxing in my office, waiting for business. It was a dingy little one-room affair, but it would serve for now. Particularly with no clients. I had poured myself a double shot, and was about to enjoy it, when suddenly the door opened.
A man walked in, familiar somehow although I couldn't place him. I reached out my hand instinctively, and instead of shaking it, he handed me a dollar.
"Hello?"
He pointed at the sign in the window, advertising a promotional one dollar gold survey for the first client. Always astute, I quickly surmised he wished to hire me.
"Of course, sir! What coin would you like?"
"Ethereum."
"Certainly! And may I have your name for the log?"
"Tyler Durdan."
And with that, my newest client left. I downed my double and poured a generous triple to follow it. This was going to be a long day.
Ethereum was the ultimate prize in my line of work. The coin which proved the adage that truth is stranger than fiction; which had proved itself a lucrative source of comedy gold.
And who am I? Guy Noir, private comedy gold surveyor. I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Premined scamcoins crashing on noname exchanges. I watched popcorn glitter in the dark on forgotten the BCT threads. Popcorn junkies strung out on a high, and I've delivered them more comedy gold, popcorn, salt and butter. There is never enough.
A dark night in a world that never sleeps and knows how to keep its secrets...But on the 12th Floor of the Acme Building, one man is still trying to find the answers to life's persistent questions: Guy Noir, private comedy gold surveyor.
Thank you, Narrator. Now, as I was saying, Ethereum is overloaded with gold. But the core is pretty straightforward:
Ethereum promised "smart contracts". Immutable. Turing-complete. This was what Bitcoin lacked. The bee's knees. Crypto 2.0. What could go wrong?
We'll skip over the "Inthereum" period. Perhaps the vaporware criticism was never fair: from their version, they had Proof-of-Concept code; they went through some iterations and eventually got to release.
Let's note clearly that there was plenty of time to determine some sort of official policy for what to do about a buggy or improperly written contract losing money. In Bitcoin, every hack has been a SFYL event, although it’s true that a bug in the coin itself was hard forked away before. Mt. Gox tried to blame malleability, but there was never a fork to try to recover funds. In Ethereum, immutability was often talked about. So far as I saw in skimming, “what if” scenarios to undo bugs wasn’t brought up front-and-center. Nor was immutability being debated that I saw.
So Ethereum releases. A major contract is launched, The DAO, which gets an astonishing portion of ETH invested. The world's largest crowd sale as they ultimately called it. All the major players in ETH buy into it, including Vitalik Buterin, the creator of Ethereum and the best name in cryptocurrency.
Just as they're starting to get into the comedy gold that The DAO doesn't really have a purpose, a bug is discovered. And just as its leader is assuring everyone that no funds are at risk, the funds start being drained out of the contract by an unknown party.
And suddenly immutable means "immutable unless we screw up on the biggest contract which everyone important has invested in heavily". Ethereum ultimately hard-forks to return investor funds and basically unwind The DAO. After claiming that the bug was in the contract, the coin itself is hard forked to fix the issue. And the first Ethereum clone results, one which simply does not follow the new hard fork.
So the natural question is: when can a contract be changed? In the first page of the Ethereum launch, this question was implied by asking about what would happen if there were an assassination market hosted by a smart contract on Ethereum. Of course, in reality, Ethereum is not really functional enough at present to enforce such a contract, but the question remains in case Ethereum were to actually attain a functioning smart contract platform.
Attempted reference to Tears in rain monologue, credit to Rutger Hauer
Guy Noir and narrator text lovingly stolen from Prairie Home Companion's Guy Noir, by Garrison B. Keillor.

Researcher’s Rant

Filed for psych eval
Twenty pages into the BCT ANN, I believe I have contracted cancer, again. I’m reminded of why I don’t generally go on BCT. As bad as altcoin forums tend to be for their circlejerking, it’s almost better than the, well, there’s really no way to put it other than FUD that inevitably appears in response to anything. Of course, it’s not paid shilling so much as it is willful and vocal ignorance. For all the critiques in that thread, most of them are utter nonsense and simply are misreading the initial information. On the other hand, it’s January 27th in the thread by now, with February 1st and the pre-sale start, and they don’t have their “prospectus” up yet. I also haven’t seen the change in mining rate yet.
Side note: eMunie; wtf? I guess I missed something? Either it’s gone through a namechange or it’s dead, because a quick coinmarketcap search didn’t find anything. A comedy gold mining project for another day.
Great; spoiler alert: fundraiser delayed apparently, so even more cancer to read through in that thread on the way to getting to a prospectus!
The first 44 pages of the thread was summarized thus: “I want to believe. Why are you not speaking to us? Throw me a bone. Just tell me what I want to hear, and I'll gladly throw my money in.” [ 5 ] Would that I had only had to read that quote rather than all 44 pages, and facing many more.
Pages and comments dragged on as I waded through the low-grade popcorn. When would this prospectus be released, so my torment would end? Oh god: a side-thread shows that by the time they get to April, there’s still no prospectus or presale date or estimate of when there may be a date [ 6 ]. It’s time to give up on reading through the cancerous mainthread on BCT and start jumping ahead pages to find the pre-sale and prospectus.
Okay, finally, in July, they release documents and start the sale [ 7 ]. Good enough.
I have mountains of links on my desk. Comedy gold is overflowing, but this is a survey expedition, not a mining operation. But by the time it’s surveyed, there’s always so much gold lined up to mine it gets hard to leave it behind and leave with the samples.
It’s time to hammer out some copy and close this file.
Folks, we hope you’ve enjoyed this descent into madness and comedy gold brought to you by the Comedy Gold Survey Company and our patron Tyler Durden. Do you need more comedy gold in your life? Of course you do! So please donate today; every $1 helps! I’ve added a new special: $5 lets you choose the next coin to be surveyed!
Thanks again to Tyler Durden, and I will now be re-watching Fight Club and questioning my sanity. Cheers y’all!
Resources:
Edit: 3/26/2020: Removed a link to a comment per request from the user.
Footnotes and other links:
submitted by coinaday to Buttcoin [link] [comments]

I would like to address FUD regarding colored coins and ChromaWallet

I am the lead developer of ChromaWallet. I've noticed that people who are presumably proponents of competing projects post comments which are dismissive and hostile towards colored coins and ChromaWallet. In many cases these posts are based on information which is only half-true, or sometimes not true at all. I'd like to address this unfair criticism here instead of chasing each individual comment.
FUD: Colored coins are irrelevant, because we already have Counterparty. (Also, Mastercoin, Ethereum, BitShares, NXT and so on.)
This would be true if Counterparty could do everything which colored coins can, but that's just not true. Counterparty uses a fundamentally different approach, which means that some things which can be implemented on top of colored coins are impossible with Counterparty, particularly:
Fast trading. First of all, let's consider how it is done in Counterparty: orders are submitted as separate transactions, which can be included into blockchain in arbitrary order. That means that you cannot reliably cancel an order or change price until your original transaction gets into a Bitcoin block, which takes on average 10 minutes. Thus you cannot change price very often (don't forget that you pay a transaction fee for each new order).
Also, you know whether your order was matched only after it is in a block, which, again, takes something on scale of 10 minutes. If you want to buy an asset for Bitcoin, it's even worse; first you need to find a matching order, and then you need to do a Bitcoin payment. In the best case, this requires two Bitcoin blocks, thus average time is 20 minutes. In the worst case, if your Bitcoin transaction is confirmed too late, you will lose your Bitcoins without getting that asset. On the sellers end, you might wait for several hours, but payment won't arrive.
On the bright side, Coutnerparty "dex" requires only Bitcoin network/blockchain. So it is highly available. But slow. Potentially problematic when you use Bitcoin as a currency.
On the other hand, in case with colored coins, trading protocol can be implemented as a separate protocol built on top of core coloring protocol and atomic transactions. As such, it is very flexible, you can choose trade-offs relevant to your particular applications.
Let's consider a specific protocol, p2ptrade (which was first released, as a working proof-of-concept, in January 2013, as a part of ArmoryX):
ArmoryX is dead now, but the similar thing is implemented in ChromaWallet, so you can see yourself that it takes around 5 seconds to complete a trade, not 10 minutes, and not 1 hour.
Micropayment channels, transaction aggregation: Paying a standard Bitcoin fee for each payment is not cool, for many applications that's too much. With colored coins we can use almost all standard Bitcoin features, which can make payments much cheaper and/or faster. I don't think that can work with Counterparty.
SPV: With colored coins, we can implement a "thin" client which will be able to independently verify payments without downloading the whole blockchain. In fact, that's how ChromaWallet works now, it's very similar to Electrum. We can also implement a mobile and in-browser clients which do not need to trust the server.
I could go on, but I hope it's obvious that Counterparty isn't the best at everything, and there might be some room for colored coins. (To be fair, there are certain things which Counterparty can do, but colored coins can't: Counterparty can resolve CFDs and bets based on asset price automatically.)
As for other projects (NXT, Ethereum, BitShares...), they have numerous advantages, but still aren't completely "dominating" over colored coins: I believe the fact that colored coins can provide complete integration with Bitcoin is a significant feature which justifies its existence.
FUD: Development is slow.
Answer: This is partially true.
First of all, few words about ChromaWallet. It started as an open source project supported by donations, which allowed us to to release an alpha version. But then, after donations dwindled, development pace have drastically slowed down. But recently we have organized a for-profit company which will continue to develop ChromaWallet, hopefully at much faster pace. (The wallet will remain open source, of course; we're going to monetize services which will be useful to wallet's users.) One example of what it have already done is coloredcoinjs-lib, a JS library for colored coins. It is something like 90% complete after one month of development.
Then there are several other projects like CoinPrism and Iridis, which are making good progress.
So, yeah, it could be faster, but it is hardly a reason to dismiss colored coins.
FUD: Development efforts are fragmented.
Answer: Well, they are: there are several different implementations. I don't see it as a bad thing, though: there are, probably, dozens of different potential applications of colored coins. We don't need same piece of software doing everything.
I see colored coins as a toolkit for implementing different kinds of applications on top of Bitcoin blockchain, not as a particular standard.
FUD: ChromaWallet isn't working.
I'm fairly certain it's working. It has some deficiencies (like some error messages are displayed in console instead of being shown in GUI), but they are relatively minor. What's important, you can send and receive payments, even p2ptrade is working. Still, it is a beta. We would rather take more time for testing and fixing, thus we ask people to avoid using it for anything of value. Better be safe than sorry, you know.
FUD: ChromaWallet requires complex installation process.
This was true for alpha release which was in December, but not for more recent beta release. Just download, unpack and it works. We're working on web and mobile versions now...
FUD: p2ptrade is not decentralized, there is no colored coins decentralized exchange!
Well, it depends on how you define a "decentralized exchange", of course.
p2ptrade, as implemented in ArmoryX and ChromaWallet, relies on a communication channel implemented as an HTTP service. The thing is, anybody can run his own service. So it is definitely decentralized, as it allows two (or more) parties to trade without relying on a central service.
Also, Iridis implements a similar thing which uses BitMessage for communication.
submitted by killerstorm to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Log of AMA @ ark.io/slack with bitbay.market - @dzimbeck (David Zimbeck), @Munti (Bjørn Alsos)

dr10 Let us all welcome team from :bitbay: bitbay.market :bitbay: - @dzimbeck (David zimbeck ) and @Munti (Bjørn Alsos). You can all start asking them questions. I'd ask team from bitbay.market to use @ username to the one they are responding to and I'd like to ask all the community to give them some time to catch up if too many questions in backlog, before asking more so questions don't get lost. Thank you!
dzimbeck Hi
dr10 Hello
Munti Hi
dzimbeck Wow you guys have quite the slack. 7k people
dzimbeck very professional site too, always noticed that
dr10 haha, yeah grew a bit over time
dzimbeck Also a decent domain.
arigard @dzimbeck Man, I remember you from back in the day in Blackcoin
dzimbeck Haha yes that is where I started
dr10 okay guys, start with your questions :wink:
Munti Is there anyone helping us keep track of any questions we might miss because we are busy answering?
dzimbeck But I'm not the dev of Blackcoin
dzimbeck I only wrote Halo into it because I needed an alt
dr10 I have an eye on the chat and people notice when you didnt answer it, dont worry :smile:
dzimbeck and didn't want to start a pump thing
tranzer What is BitBay in few words. Are you anonymous marketplace? (edited)
dzimbeck Unbreakable contracts, Anonymous serverless markets and rolling peg
dzimbeck all of those features are extremely important for decentralization and computer science in general
dzimbeck "Unbreakable contracts" is the non-technical term for "Double deposit escrow"
dzimbeck It works by both parties placing a deposit in a joint account
dzimbeck and if they cheat each other they both lose their funds when the time limit expires
dzimbeck making the contract somewhat unbreakable
dzimbeck regardless of what is agreed to
btcmacroecon what if one cheats the other?
dzimbeck since it's a joint account
btcmacroecon hunt them down?
dzimbeck you need that person to sign off
dzimbeck so they lose money
dzimbeck they can't cheat you
dzimbeck example:
dzimbeck you want to buy a guitar
dzimbeck which costs 100 dollars
dzimbeck so you put up a deposit of 100 and also 100 into the joint account
dzimbeck the seller also puts up 100 to guarantee shipping and their own honesty
dzimbeck when the seller sends the guitar if you steal it
dzimbeck then seller won't sign off on the contract
dzimbeck causing both parties to lose money
dzimbeck (you just paid 200 for a 100 dollar it)
dzimbeck So this forces users to work together
dzimbeck better than E-bay with arbiters
dzimbeck in fact.. I am shocked this isn't the industry standard
tranzer Are there any limits on how much can someone sell or buy item for?
dzimbeck I've been doing this for 4 years since BitHalo started
Munti When you use double deposit escrow, your protection is based upon the fact that no one can gain anything by breaking the deal. That pretty much eliminates scammers as there is no incentive for them.
btcmacroecon what if the seller "says" the other stole the guitar, when in reality it was received, it's jus seller wont sign off on it to be a dick
dzimbeck No limits
dzimbeck and deposits are negotiable (edited)
donze Nice idea
ulyssessyoungo interesting
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon Because the seller will lose money if he does
Munti I actually just bought a property in our marketplace. Got the paperwork in the mail today
donze Your market is active?
dzimbeck Being a dick doesn't profit a dime
donze Or work in progress
dzimbeck It actually costs money to be a dick
dzimbeck which is what we WANT
arigard @dzimbeck is that similar to the two way mad escrow Particl are working on?
ulyssessyoungo I like the sound of that
dzimbeck we want jerks to be broke
dzimbeck we want politicians to be the ones begging for food on the street
ulyssessyoungo do you have any system beyond that
Munti Our marketplace has been operational since early 2015
ulyssessyoungo to see if people honor the contracts?
ulyssessyoungo like user history or something
dzimbeck Oh there is tons of systems in BitBay
little_round Particl took it from bitbay
dzimbeck we actually have a wall of features
ulyssessyoungo I mean like
ulyssessyoungo say a guy has a history of blowing up contracts
dzimbeck http://bitbay.market/wall
ulyssessyoungo are those people easily identified as bad business?
tranzer Do you have numbers of how many people "were dicks" and how much was already agreed upon in your marketplace (like yearly turnaround)?
dzimbeck Yes
dzimbeck You can see how many contracts their profile has blown up
dzimbeck so you can mathematically calculate what their deposit should be!
dzimbeck It's like the perfect escrow for p2p transactions
ulyssessyoungo that's nice
Munti Actually particl (then shadowcoin) tried to hire David to make the marketplace for them many years ago. When he declined, they tried to revers enginer his code. They failed :slightly_smiling_face:
ulyssessyoungo So like a reputation system?
ulyssessyoungo I always check vendor reputations on alibaba, amazon etc.
arigard @Munti really? Interesting..
dzimbeck And it's been working for 3+ years it was actually the worlds first smart contracts
dzimbeck Yep
btcmacroecon is there a scenario when a seller would lose money if it harmed the buyer, even if seller loses money, adversely affecting the buyer, even if guitar received, to cause buyer to lose money? Or woul buyer come out ahead cause of guitar, or would that mean net loss for buyer in this scenario, despite "seller wouldn't do it cause he loses money assumption"
dzimbeck we have a reputation system
dzimbeck Yes you are right
dzimbeck but consider this @btcmacroecon
shtand Does the seller always match 100% of the value of what they're selling?
dzimbeck The seller does cause buyer to lose
dzimbeck but now they have proof they are blowing up contracts
dzimbeck who would want to work with that seller later?
dzimbeck Also that seller would be asked in future deals for a LARGER deposit
btcmacroecon ok and ebay has good marketplace for reputation.
dzimbeck meaning being a jerk is progressive;y cost inhibitive
dzimbeck And this reputation system there is no way to lie about it
Munti @dzimbeck I just noticed we both forget to use @ to make it clear who we are answering
dzimbeck because there is cryptographic proof you blew up the funds
btcmacroecon ok good to wait for established track record
dzimbeck I will use the @ more thanks
dzimbeck @shtand Not always
ulyssessyoungo eBay is good with the reputation system but not so much the arbitration
ulyssessyoungo so that makes me interested in alternatives
dzimbeck matching 1:1 is a great way to deal with strangers you don't trust
dzimbeck But a great seller might only put up 10%
ulyssessyoungo i've been screwed selling some high ticket items on ebay before, not terribly so but enough to make me wonder what the point of a middleman is if they just side with the buyer in most cases
dzimbeck exactly!!
donze safex will be full anonymous and will give dividends to those who own it, what are the advantages of bitbay other than being ahead in the roadmap?
dzimbeck But guys this isn't just buying and selling
dzimbeck who here has outsourced?
btcmacroecon What about where damage or not represented product as advertised? same thing? comes down to reputation scores?
dzimbeck @donze that would be the rolling peg we will get to that
arigard Does Bitbay have any anon functionality?
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon Realize a seller loses funds for damaged items if blown up. He will be much more motivated to work with buyer than he would be in e-bay
dzimbeck BitBays markets are anon
Munti @ donze If safex is able to pay dividends, they will need to take that money from somewhere. Fees? We have no fees (edited)
dzimbeck because they use Bitmessage
dzimbeck and we don't bloat the blockchain
dzimbeck because Bitmessage is p2p
dzimbeck and no chain is used
shtand what's determining who a 'great seller' is and what % they need to match then?
dzimbeck thus no servers
kimchi ...where does bitbay profit come from?
tranzer How is BitBay team being funded?
dzimbeck sender is hidden because messages are passed around making it hard to find the origin
dzimbeck decoding messages is plausible deniability because nobody knows if you have decryption key
dzimbeck (a market is a shared key)
dzimbeck @shtand A great seller would be someone with tons of contracts that didn't blow up
RQDxRocket joined #trading_altcoins.
arigard What about transactions, are they hidden too?
Munti @kimchi BitBay in itself does not need profit. The holders of the coin will get their profit from higher value because we gain adoption. and we are years ahead in this race, so should have a decent chance to increase price a lot
dzimbeck @kimchi I don't profit much from BitBay. We are mostly self funded
moon joined #trading_altcoins.
ulyssessyoungo Yeah it's not a centralized service so i don't see why it would need "profit" given that it's just a network
btcmacroecon does bitbay have any interest in their service being used with other projects to form a marketplace? any room for collaboration if buyers / sellers can be rounded up for establishing marketplace, reputation, including commodity trading?
ulyssessyoungo BAY is POS right?
tranzer Is BitBay POS or mineable or what consensus algo does it use?
dzimbeck @arigard Transactions aren't anon
dzimbeck but I'm a big ffan of zero knowledge proofs
dzimbeck There is ways to hide the person broadcasting using Bitmessage
dzimbeck but I haven't implemented
dzimbeck I'm a purist so if an anon route is chosen later then it will be on a very high level
arigard Will you be looking to do those kinds of things in the future? Maybe something like Zerocoin etc?
dzimbeck @tranzer POS
kimchi When can I see the beta version?
Munti @kimchi Also, Double deposit escrow ties up a lot of money, so when marketplace becomes really active , that will have tremendous impact on coin supply (reduced supply because of DDE). An average daily turnover on our marketplace of 1k dollars can create demand for as much as 30k-50k dollars worth of Bay (edited)
dzimbeck Maybe a side chain arigard
dzimbeck Since the main chain doesn't need to be anon
dzimbeck also anon would interfere with the rolling peg
dzimbeck Jesus zero proof:heart_eyes:
dzimbeck depending on what i choose for it
donze What is actual year trade volume of bitbay?
Munti @btcmacroecon BitBay is open for working with partners
dzimbeck @ulyssessyoungo yeah profit from escrow is not wise since it eliminates the middle man, we would not want the liability
dzimbeck also I meant to say earlier
dzimbeck these contracts work with employees too
dzimbeck so an employee is forced to honor his/her word
dzimbeck and employer is forced to pay
dzimbeck so no more unreliable outsourcers
Munti @donze Trade volume varies a lot like it does for most coins
dzimbeck It's been over a million a lot
btcmacroecon what do you think about creating a trading floor for commodities, or whatever "product" or "service" say "electronics" or "beer" or "metals"
dzimbeck but then it goes down to 50-500k
dzimbeck We don't fake our volume
dzimbeck :smile:
dzimbeck that is why, this is a very organic project
dzimbeck You see I used to be BitHalo
dzimbeck which was years before Ethereum
dzimbeck and was hired on to the BitBay project, the people who hired me disappeared
dzimbeck so the community and myself took it over
dzimbeck making it pretty organic
ulyssessyoungo I have been in your Slack for some time, i can vouch that you guys seem to be one of the more transparent teams.
Munti @btcmacroecon We already kind of have a trading floor for commodities. We have a fully working marketplace. In one of the comming updates we will also add templates for auctions.
dzimbeck BitHalo is still active but it's worth pointing out that all new templates and features will be withheld from BitHalo to give BitBay maximum impact
Bitbay1 uploaded this image: m2.jpg 1 Comment
btcmacroecon i like the concept and not of ebay as a seller given their fees, or as a buyer with paypal.
ulyssessyoungo lol those boots
dzimbeck Ebays biggest problem is scam buyers
dzimbeck no way to stop it
dzimbeck In our platform that is not going to happen
dzimbeck And let me stress something else
dzimbeck This is Bitcoin
dzimbeck which is anonymous
dzimbeck so scams are more prevalent
dzimbeck which is why it shocks me
dzimbeck that this isn't the industry standard for escrow
btcmacroecon but the man is wise
dzimbeck Plus we don't have to deal with arbiters
dzimbeck the analogy is you go to court... would you trust 12 peers and a judge to decide your fate?
dzimbeck I wouldn't
dzimbeck A witness where it's your word against theirs
dzimbeck This is a better system. There is no judge
dzimbeck just perp and victim
btcmacroecon i havent been to court once where the truth was spoken
dzimbeck empowering victims a little bit more
dzimbeck "instant karma"
dzimbeck That is exactly why I made this
btcmacroecon i had proof attorney was lying but judge refused to let me play it as i ha proo
dzimbeck Oh jesus
dzimbeck that sucks
btcmacroecon i was going to hit play in courtroom but she freaked out on the bench said i would not play it in her courtroom!
V01D Would there be any backlash against the name bitbay in the future if a company like eBay felt threatened?
dzimbeck Yeah also realize that losing a deposit makes a victim feel like the person who screwed them paid for it
btcmacroecon protected the liar
dzimbeck I don't think so but we can always rebrand
dzimbeck there is an exchange called BitBay too
dzimbeck timing was almost the same as ours
btcmacroecon 591 price on bay on bittrex
dzimbeck we had an international presence first
dzimbeck As for price
Munti @VO1D I don't see how ebay could do something about that. But then I'm not a lawyer
dzimbeck This IS a trading channel
V01D I see, thank you
dzimbeck we should talk about the rolling peg
btcmacroecon i sold all bay at 860
dzimbeck So when the project started I wasn't the founder
btcmacroecon pissed i could have got 870
dzimbeck so I knew there had to be a way to protect investors in case something bad happened
Munti LOL
dzimbeck So the rolling peg was designed
dzimbeck similar to an economic crawling peg
dzimbeck The way it works is this: we can control the supply of the coin by simply freezing it
dzimbeck so as most coins only inflate
dzimbeck this coin does both
dzimbeck it inflates and deflates
yin :open_mouth:
dzimbeck but it only freezes the coins temporarily to stop dumps on the market
dzimbeck and it does so exactly fairly
codnose It's been a bad 24 hours for lots of alts. It will bounce back @btcmacroecon ;)
dzimbeck coins have memory in this system so each coin knows it's own liquidity
funkedelics proof to back up your claim? Munti Actually particl (then shadowcoin) tried to hire David to make the marketplace for them many years ago. When he declined, they tried to revers enginer his code. They failed :slightly_smiling_face: Posted in #trading_altcoinsToday at 7:09 PM
dzimbeck reddit
btcmacroecon yah i hope to reposition on this coin as we speak
codnose Good few days for bay recently. I'm holding since a while back
dzimbeck there is proof where I fought with veritasBS from ShadowCash
dzimbeck They tried to reverse my code
Bitbay1 Freezing via decentralized voting?
dzimbeck it was famous
funkedelics link?
Munti @funkedelics On reddit as David said. I'm sure we can find a link for you after this session is over
dzimbeck Someone else can find it
dzimbeck @funkedelics
dzimbeck It is on the blackcoin subreddit
btcmacroecon what are you doing to avoid illegal activity, kyc, and silk road activity?
dzimbeck if you wanna look
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon I have a mod key which users subscribe to
dzimbeck which is handed out
dzimbeck so decentralized mod i guess
dzimbeck also users encrypt their IP within their orders
dzimbeck so if for some reason a swat team shows up at my house I just tell them they are free to use it
kimchi What is the return or refund?..
dzimbeck In theory we shouldn't need to deal with silk road type problems
btcmacroecon id say get a fkn warrant, shut the door
dzimbeck since we don't host anything
dzimbeck That too
codnose Rolling peg sounds very interesting. Is there a link here?
dzimbeck But we don't live in a fair world @btcmacroecon
dzimbeck USA arrested a guy in Greece who was a Russian citizen
dzimbeck nonsense
btcmacroecon and those that vote i big corrupt government blame trump
dzimbeck https://bitbay.market/about/pegging/ BitBay Rolling Peg - BitBay Price volatility is cryptocurrency's biggest challenge - BitBay's rolling peg will reduce volatility by dynamically controlling supply. Learn more here.
dzimbeck Never blame Trump
dzimbeck blame military intelligence
dzimbeck and compartmentalization
Munti @codnose our site is going through a little redesign atm, but the info on the rolling peg will be back up soon
btcmacroecon new vorld odor! I blame "globalism"
imyb commented on Bitbay1’s file m2.jpg Is this really what it's going to look like?
dzimbeck :smile:
codnose Great thanks @Munti
Munti LOL, it was back up (edited)
dzimbeck well whatever powerful people do
dzimbeck it's our job to come up with solutions like unbreakable contracts
dzimbeck these contracts work in an anarchy
dzimbeck literally
dzimbeck The rolling peg is meant to allow low cap coins
dzimbeck to thrive
little_round @imyb No, it will be changed
dzimbeck because the control of supply lets us force the price
dzimbeck by voting on supply
yin damn your product sounds awesome! but you need a redesign of your website :smile:
dzimbeck so example
btcmacroecon so you in essence have a dashboard already active.
dzimbeck if a user has 1000 coins at 100% at .10 cents per coin
WeeMan Mike joined #trading_altcoins.
dzimbeck and the network deflates to 50%
dzimbeck he would have 500 coins liquid and 500 frozen
Munti @btcmacroecon What do you mean by dashboard?
dzimbeck he can move the liquid coins as much as he wants
btcmacroecon you have a marketplace or dashboard like ebay has basically?
dzimbeck the frozen coins he can move but with a penalty a one month delay
Munti @btcmacroecon Yes (edited)
dzimbeck which makes a secondary market for trading frozen coins
codnose Like the eBay dashboard right @btcmacroecon ?
dzimbeck at a more speculative value
btcmacroecon you just need to expand on it with volume
Bitbay1 https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9hEpu8gZMzEcP22rMYX0Iw/videos YouTube BitBay Official BitBay youtube channel
dzimbeck we can assume his liquid coins would be worth about double than before if demand is about the same
btcmacroecon do you offer any affiliate programs to market for that volume?
dzimbeck Good idea
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon Working on that now
dzimbeck We have just started discussions about incentives
dzimbeck @kimchi please elaborate
dzimbeck return or refund on what?
kimchi I bought shoes. But what if a brick comes? There is an image on top that sells shoes.
dzimbeck Then seller would pay 100 dollars
dzimbeck if you blow it up
dzimbeck so negotiate a refund
dzimbeck the seller will most definitely reconsider
dzimbeck since he doesn't want to pay 100 dollars to be a joker
dzimbeck You can cancel contracts
dzimbeck returning all funds
Anoeng joined #trading_altcoins.
dzimbeck upon mutual consent
dzimbeck everything is consent
btcmacroecon does bitbay have the ability to accept payment in a variety of cryptocurrency? I think that's where volume could come in, or a gateway to exchange tokens and buyer / seller can arrive at payment and yet can be worked via bitbay smart contract or escrowing? could that work, is it possible, if not care to explore it?
dzimbeck the way a contract should be
dzimbeck Yes
codnose Ha that's awesome actually. Why would a seller send anything else knowing they'd lose their deposit ?
dzimbeck You can use Ark to pay
dzimbeck Bay is only used as a deposit
dzimbeck you might have to specify the coins you would accept in your contract
ulyssessyoungo nice
ulyssessyoungo i like that
btcmacroecon and what about dogecoin for example?
codnose Yeah that's cool
ulyssessyoungo Definitely adds to the viability of the platform
codnose Whatcoin? Lol
dzimbeck yeah codnose it forces honesty
dzimbeck and the same for employees
Munti @btcmacroecon Also, our platform is very broad. You can use it for almost anything. We already had all kinds of things sold there from pins to property. Many coins have also been sold there. Our market is like an improved localbitcoin. Binary opptions is also you can find on our marketoplace regularly. And I'm sure we havent even scrathced the surface yet. In the future we will have API's so ppl can tailor their own version of our marketplace.
dzimbeck if I hire someone using this system
btcmacroecon ok deposit only, making more sense now
ulyssessyoungo BAY as a currency would certainly take off best after the Rolling Peg
dzimbeck they better do what they say
ulyssessyoungo but in the meantime that's awesome that you can use other coins
dzimbeck I actually used to it motivate myself
Bitbay1 Why not sell Ark for Bay on the market :slightly_smiling_face:
Bitbay1 or Btc
dzimbeck had my friend blow up my money if I didn't do my daily errands
dzimbeck imagine having 10 grand deterrent
dzimbeck :smile:
bivins Greetings
dzimbeck You can trade coins on the market
dzimbeck especially microtrade
codnose You bought some land using this you said @Munti ?
dzimbeck but it is slow
dzimbeck for that I recommend atomic trade
dzimbeck It's not that fast paced trading that traders demand...
dzimbeck but
codnose No worries about losing any money ? I take it it wasn't just a few dollars
dzimbeck Someone did sell IOTA on our platform
dzimbeck and did lots of deals
Bitbay1 yes before IOTA came into the exchanges
Munti @codnose Yes I did. Got the paperwork in the mail today. 5 acres of land in California. (And I live in Norway) (edited)
prasanth can we stake coins in the market client??
Munti Yes
dzimbeck Staking is done using 2 keys
dzimbeck so you can actually stake over LAN too
tranzer Could BitBay somehow bridge with Ark and offer their services to Ark users?
dzimbeck using 2 computers
dzimbeck it's called "cold staking"
dzimbeck no hacking is possible here
dzimbeck ever
dzimbeck you can hide keys in images
btcmacroecon ok i admit failure on setting up CoinURL as I tried to set up online store, to sell some code, my wildlife photography, and rocks and gems I prospect, I'd like to set up BitBay on an Iframe into my site, and capture affiliate biz. Sounds like this is almost possible, and I could sell my jade right through my site, at least offer it up, right?
dzimbeck and have dual passwords and use 2 computers to sign transactions automated
Munti @tranzer We would have to look into that. But I don't see any reason why we could not.
dzimbeck We need a web wallet
dzimbeck that is our biggest challenge
dzimbeck since I made this with a "security first" attitude
dzimbeck being a cryptographer (edited)
dzimbeck I forgot the reason to make everything web based
Munti @btcmacroecon We are not quite there yet, but yes, that's where we're going
dzimbeck Didn't want to sacrifice security
dzimbeck now I realize there is a need for web based platforms
codnose I follow you on twitter and saw that mentioned the other day. It's coming soon? @dzimbeck
dzimbeck that sacrifice a little security for speed and ease of use in phones
dzimbeck A web wallet?
codnose Yeah
dzimbeck Yeah well we will have a basic web wallet very soon
dzimbeck its actually a very nice one (edited)
dzimbeck But I was referring to a market wallet
dzimbeck one with the full contract implementation
dzimbeck we hope to do that after the peg is successful
Munti Keep an eye on our next weekly update (sunday) for roadmap for the rest of this year. You will get details there
dzimbeck since it's more important to deliver on what I promise
dzimbeck than to make up new features
dzimbeck aka "scope creep" a programmers worst enemy
mergatroid Hello
dzimbeck Hi
mergatroid Please comment on recent news around SEC delistings on bittrex - what steps are you taking to communicate with user base as to whether your a security and what you plan to do if you are classified as such
dzimbeck The rolling peg is the priority
dzimbeck Since Tether is unreliable
dzimbeck this is a decentralized peg
dzimbeck that isn't fixed at a certain price
dzimbeck so it can "roll" the price up
codnose Sounds like you have a lot of nice things planned :)
dzimbeck so it starts at say 5 cents
dzimbeck and slowly rolls up to 10 cents
dzimbeck over X amount of time
dzimbeck after that we would love to focus on web implementations
dzimbeck however anyone who wants to plug this into their site should contact us, we can set up some API calls for sure
Munti @mergatroid I just became aware of the SEC issue on Bittrex today, and have not had time to study it. But going by the little I did read, it doesn't seem to be a problem for us.
mergatroid Ok - so no plan so far understand
dzimbeck we aren't a security
dzimbeck because we don't pay dividends
mergatroid Thankyou
codnose Just on your website now @dzimbeck @Munti
dr10 OK we are approaching 1 hour mark. If you guys have any questions left, go ahead. Anything bitbay.market team would like to add or tell - feel free to do.
V01D Thanks for your time bitbay team
dzimbeck Thanks for doing this! It was fun. And maybe I have a few questions about Ark later
dzimbeck :slightly_smiling_face:
codnose Looking good. Thanks for stopping by :)
dzimbeck Any other questions?
dzimbeck Perhaps regarding the peg, contracts or markets?
Boris Is dzimbeck a god?
dzimbeck :smile:
dzimbeck no
dzimbeck I bleed
codnose Haha I'd heard that too
codnose At least in coding terms lol
dr10 Thank you David and Bjørn for taking the time to do this AMA! All the best with the project and you are always welcome to hang around our Slack
Munti If anyone wants more info, you are welcome to our slack http://bitbay.market/wp-login.php?action=slack-invitation
dzimbeck Honestly a little bit of effort is all these things take
dzimbeck Thanks dr10
Munti Thanks for having us. This was fun
submitted by Dr10tv to BitBay [link] [comments]

Bitcoin, an idea I think you should be a part of

I’m not immune to the weaknesses of Bitcoin - of which there are many. It’s not a panacea for all world problems - far from it. There’s a massive unknowable black hole that is the future and there’s absolutely no telling what may come of it, with nearly 8 billion actors each playing their own part on their own terms. I’m a realist through and through, and these limitations are what ground me.
But I can’t begin to express what the idea of Bitcoin has done to me. I know this isn’t the beginning. It’s one of a long chain of events that goes back to the first government on Earth and those who suffered under it. However in my opinion, Bitcoin has the potential to be second only to the Internet as the most extraordinary phenomenon of our lifetime. And this time around, we get to be a part of it from the very start.
Below is a quote from a thread on /economics where people (read: Keynesians and other status quo’ers) were bashing Bitcoin from every angle, and the responses weren’t quite adequate. This quote came in late in the game and rose to the top quickly - it seemed like people on both sides just started to “get it”:
The status quo is simply unacceptable. Companies such as paypal and visa have cornered the entire market for paying for things; goods and services, online - taking a good share of the money for doing very little, with them.
This is the internet and if you believe in some of the ideology that founded it and drives much of the major technology that it’s based on, you probably accept the need for open source software. In many ways bitcoin is similar. We absolutely NEED a secure, trustworthy way of exchanging money that companies, countries, banks and big business cannot mess with. Think of all that has happened in the last 10 years.
Moreover, behind bitcoin’s controversial and complex veneer are some truly nifty advancements in technology. For more than a while a big philosophical and technological hurdle to decentralizing network systems (be it computers, or people) has been the issue of trust: if there is no central authority, can we create a system in which most (51% or more) of the network can trust each other (see the two generals problem). The bitcoin methodology is one, fantastic solution that may have practical implications beyond currency (see the bitcoin DNS system or the new bitmessaging software to name but two).
Along with that advancement in trust and decentralization, bitcoin brings a great deal of features including anonymity (not guaranteed, but very possible), security, divisibility (for once, micro-transactions are truly possible) and portability (i.e. it can go anywhere the network reaches) to the way we trade.
So whilst for now it’s main use might be as a store of value, and that i can see, is questionable - ultimately its true test will be day to day transacting. There is a great deal more to do in order to make it easier to use for the average person - i.e. to develop and promote the software required for business and individuals to use it effectively. But we’ve come a long way in 5 short years.
But ultimately, bitcoin is a grand experiment, a test to see if crypto-currencies can work. It might fail, eventually, but be under no illusions that not too far from now, something similar will eventually become mainstream -> this is the future.
On a personal note, it’s also incredibly fascinating to watch and i’m rooting for it. [sic]
And that’s the crux, isn’t it? A grand experiment, a marriage of politics, philosophy, economics, and technology – and one whose legacy won’t soon be forgot.
Whether or not Bitcoin will become a global currency weapon crippling governments or die out as another innovative idea from an as-yet-undiscovered Achilles heel (or likely something in between), it has already won in so many ways. How so? Because it has shown those individuals who were intellectually prepared (people like us) that a game changer like this is more than just an anarchist’s wet dream.
Dan Kaminsky, a leading cryptographer and tech security specialist examined the Bitcoin source code and concluded that the infamous Satoshi Nakamoto was “a world-class programmer with a deep understanding of the C++ programming language” who understood “economics, cryptography, and peer-to-peer networking. Either there’s a team of people who worked on this or this guy is a genius.”
The following is a quote from Satoshi in response to another’s doubts, dated November 7, 2008 on the Cryptography Mailing List, where Bitcoin was born:
[Lengthy exposition of vulnerability of a system to use-of-force monopolies ellided.]
You will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography.
Yes, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.
I’m probably off my rocker at this point and succumbing to delusions of grandeur. I certainly wouldn’t be the first. But also… maybe not.
Paul Graham might have been talking specifically about startups when he said, “Live in the future, then build what’s missing,” but I’m taking heed to his words in a broader sense. We are young, intelligent, and (I’d like to believe) “get it”. Let’s be a part of the revolution. Let’s be generals in the next battle.
submitted by 3mergent to Anarcho_Capitalism [link] [comments]

Bitmessage Update suggestions to handle scaling

I've been mulling over a revision to the design of Bitmessage, and considering writing up a huge design document. But I think I may be better off just dumping my ideas here, and getting constructive feedback before undertaking a full design. So here goes. Please give it a critical look and tell me what you think.
The mission is to suggest some philosophical design changes so that scaling and spam prevention can be accomplished.
Proof of Work is a good idea, with a non-ideal implementation
The recent attacks on Bitmessage demonstrated that the current Proof of Work algorithm really didn't prevent a massive spam mailing.
My suggestions are to use Proof of Work to really prove valuable work that was done for the betterment of Bitmessage.
Bitmessage has two major "work" components - message storage and message distribution. Nodes should be measured based on their contribution to those functions, and when sufficient "work" has been demonstrated, they can inject messages into the system.
Bitcoin has a Proof of Work function designed to sequence transactions. This make sense, because that's a valuable function of the overall system. The current Bitmessage PoW simply has you do busywork to justify injecting messages into the system (which has some merit), but due to the inequality of devices, it's not an effective system for flood protection, spam protection, or growth control.
When is a node performing valuable work?
From the perspective of each node, there are messages that they want to receive, there are messages that they want to distribute, and then there are messages that they don't really care about.
Distributing messages that you care about (such as ones that are from you) shouldn't be a "rewarded" activity - you are generally asking a favor of the network of systems, to distribute the message for you. Yet there needs to be a way to identify, when I am doing work (i.e. storage or distribution), am I doing the network a favor, or am I asking the network to do a favor for me. And this determination needs to be in a manner that is non-revealing.
Basically, every message has a destination address, and if I am interested in that destination address (perhaps I have the private key for it), then I WANT someone to transmit to me, so the node that transmits to me is doing me a favor. On the contrary, if I am not interested in the destination address, I am doing the network a favor by accepting and distributing that message.
Here I introduce a new concept. I suggest that there be a Preference String for each node, that determines which destination addresses I prefer, and which ones I don't prefer. Each node can determine their own Preference String, and can change it regularly. The concept here is that there is a function whose inputs are the Preference String and the Destination Address, and the output is a string of bits (say, 256 bits), which tells how much I prefer that destination address.
f (Preference String, Destination Address) = Preference Level.
You can interpret the Preference Level as a number in the range of 0 <= Preference Level < 1. All 1 bits means the highest preference for this destination address, and all 0 bits means a disdain (negative preference) for this destination address. Neutrality would be at the .5 level.
So the function can be as simple as Preference Level = SHA-256(Preference String +(concatenate) Destination Address) or an other simple function.
A "job" of the client program would be to choose Preference String so that the Channel Addresses and Other Destination Addresses that I prefer (i.e. have the private keys for, and can decrypt) get a high Preference Level when run through this function.
Likewise, when selecting new "random" destination addresses for use, the client software will choose a Destination Address that returns a high Preference Level, when the Preference Function is utilized.
In this way, each node can state their preference for certain messages in a simple "Preference String", without identifying which specific private keys they have, or which channels they are reading.
Proof of Work - receipts from other nodes
My mission, when receiving a message for distribution, is to route it to someone who has a preference for this message, so that I can get a "signed receipt" as a proof of work. So I may accept messages simply to accumulate receipts (which prove that I contributed to the system in a positive way).
When I want to inject a new message into the system, it's a matter of convincing others to store and distribute the message. Anyone with a high enough "preference" for the message will have interest in storage, and will reward me for sending it to them (particularly if their preference is higher than mine). To get others to distribute the message, I cash in "recent" receipts, from favors that I did for them.
In other words, I perform work (favors) for other nodes. Then when I want/need a message distributed, I "cash in" those previously earned favors, or generate receipts for other nodes for the favors that they are doing for me. These receipts that I generate are really just signing over receipts that I received from others.
In this way, nodes are incentivized to contribute to the system before taking from the system.
Forget Public Hashes of Addresses, and just use the public key
The current Bitmessage system goes to great lengths to have simple BM-xxxxx hashes, and distribute those along with the public keys. I think we should consider getting rid of that. When someone wants to send a message, they simply use the public key. This way, there need not be any passing of the public keys back and forth (like "hey, does anyone know the public key for BM-123435xx?"). Just send to the public key address directly.
Forget Streams
By using a Preference String and function, messages will be routed to the people who want them. No need for Streams. No need to have the Stream number in your address. Eliminate all that. This problem is solved with Preference Strings.
Use known timestamping
In some instances, we may want to timestamp something. For instance, timestamping a message. Or timestamping receipts for favors. (Favor Receipts become less and less valuable as they age.)
I suggest integrating with the Bitcoin system which already has a fully functioning timestamping service (at least from the perspective of block numbers and block hashes). When a message comes onto the Bitmessage network, you can grab the most recent Bitcoin block hashes, and include that with the message header, which identifies a time when it entered the network. When it's 2.5 days old, you know it fairly definitively. (But accommodations need to be made for Bitcoin orphaned blocks from routine blockchain forks. This is a minor complication, and can easily be overcome.)
In short, Bitmessage could help the bitcoin network, by acting as nodes on the network, while using Bitcoin for its strong sequencing capabilities. Bitcoin is generating a new block hash every ten minutes (or so), and Bitmessage can use that to its advantage.
Likewise, every node gets to select its own Preference String. But you probably don't want them changing all the time. So each Preference String would have an associated version number, which could correspond to the most recent Bitcoin Block Hash value. So I can easily tell how old someone's Preference String is, and which one is newer, if I get conflicting ones. This would also help to restrict the frequent changing of these Preference Strings (if that is a desirable thing).
What does the Preference Level really mean?
The Preference Level determines how much you value messages sent to various Destination Addresses. The higher the preference, the more valuable each "recent" byte of storage of that message. So, each node will manage its local storage to store recent highly preferred messages. In this way, local storage can be limited by the user, and only highly preferred messages will be kept for any length of time. (Not sure how this blends with the 2.5 day scheme... Might need to think about that.)
So are there any ideas in here that have merit?
Edit 1 As I mentioned below, by modifying the protocol so that we send to the public address, and not to a hash of the public address (the BM-stuff that we are doing now), we can actually enable frequency hopping for even better anonymity and spam protection.
submitted by 17chk4u to bitmessage [link] [comments]

I've been a fan of the blockchain for a few years now, but I have serious concerns about bitcoin itself. Care to calm my fears?

As the title mentions, I'm a huge fan of the blockchain. I think it's wonderful P2P tech, and it's already in use for amazing things like namecoin and even spin-off projects like bitmessage (doesn't use a blockchain, but similar tech for PoW and authentication).
Even bitcoin, when it first popped up, seemed like amazing stuff. I definitely am a fan of trustless/p2p currency. However, I can't help but notice that bitcoin has a couple of obvious problems (namecoin shares them, but the problem isn't as bad, given it's not intended to be a currency and also has a base of value).
The most obvious problem to me is one that seems to plague cryptocurrency in general: pre-mining. The idea that the early-adopters can become absurdly wealthy simply by getting there first. I read over on /buttcoin that Satoshi has 20% of the possible bitcoin? Is that true? That seems like it'd lead to massive wealth inequality once those coins do start moving. And there's certainly countless others with hundreds of thousands of bitcoin simply because they were handed out like candy at the beginning. For someone coming in, a single bitcoin is $400. Whereas early adopters got a few hundred with a couple of hours of mining on a laptop. How is that fair?
The mining cap. This is another huge problem. At first I was fond of it, as it put a hard cap on inflation, meaning that the currency is deflationary instead. This is a good feature, but with an obvious flaw: it rewards early adopters, and it promotes hoarding bitcoin rather than spending it (the whole point of a currency!). Along with that, any coins that are 'destroyed' (namecoin does this), and/or lost, are essentially gone forever. Meaning that over time the amount of possible bitcion will reduce to nothing. This is not a valid long-term ideal. This simply doubles down on bitcoin's huge problem (massive inequality between early/late adopters).
And lastly, the distribution of new coins. This is already a huge problem with fiat currency, and I'm baffled at why bitcoin copied this model of distributing wealth to 'bankers' (miners who manage the blockchain). Not only does it promote the rich-get-richer structure, not only does it reward those who got there earliest and stay there longest, but it also creates a continually rising paywall to actually get in on the action. There's no way to get bitcoin without working for someone else already in the system or spending potentially thousands of dollars to get a tiny amount of bitcoin that's mined.
Though, to be fair, it's not just bitcoin's problem. It's all alt-coins who share these issues without changing stuff.
There's also the issue of increasing computation demand, leading to waste and potentially harming the environment.
Personally, I like something like uCoin, which implements the relative theory of money into a blockchain/bitcoin style structure.
So... can anyone calm these fears that bitcoin will simply be yet another USD spin-off and run into the exact same problems of wealth concentration?
Keep in mind, I do like the blockchain and similar tech. And I do like the goal of bitcoin itself. It's definitely a great first step. I just can't get around these glaring problems that seem to almost guarantee that bitcoin will die in the future.
submitted by Kafke to btc [link] [comments]

Meet gHash, a distributed ridesharing platform built on top of Bitmessage network

Notice: We've decided to rename the project and go with Flash for the platform and Garrick for the reference implementation.
Hi everyone,
we've finally found some time to implement a minimal viable product of a distributed ridesharing platform built on top of Bitmessage network during our latest internal hackathon.
The platform will use existing infrastructure where possible so no application specific coins and blockchains ever, and no Bitmessage fork anytime soon. In this phase, it does a little more than nearby driver discovery.
What you need to run the application:
For testing purposes I've chosen the place of Neutral Moresnet for its relatively small size. You can use any place on Earth, though you might not find another peer there.
To let everyone know there is a seat in your car available, just send a JSON message following the version 0.1 Flash schema from any Bitmessage client to this channel: Flash.NeutralMoresnet / BM-2cUEvdHd7C37poxWGTwNeJjDkvxH3t99Yg
To find a seat available in a car nearby, open the Flash application in your browser, edit the connection details (once they are correct and connection with a Bitmessage node API is established, you should see a Connect button, that will save your details for the next time to a localStorage key/value pair). Then, specify the pick up and drop off location, and Request a ride. You should see the cars that meet your requirements on the map (they operate in the right territory, have a seat available, and are closer than 5 km according to their last known position). Click on the marker to see the details and a Bitmessage address of the driver.
Notice: A point is always an array consisting of a longitude/latitude pair ([x, y]), not the other way around.
See the /examples folder of the GitHub repo for examples of a message including updates.
To quit offering a seat in your car, send another message with seats set to 0 (see /examples above).
Phase 1 Automate the whole process from both the driver's and the passenger's view including Bitcoin payment details and add support for a custom payment method (cash, PayPal...).
Communication between both parties can take place on a ride specific channel so other parties can be easily invited (arbiter for dispute resolution, representative of a security agency in case anything goes wrong).
Explore the possibility to upload an archive containing map tiles and data for simple geocoding system (address to a longitude/latitude pair) and write an app to export the data from OpenStreetMap or another platform.
Add a reputation checker feature through Bitrated or similar.
Split the project into the Flash platform and the Garrick application.
Refactor the code.
Phase 2 Convert the web app to a Cordova app for mobile devices with an embedded Bitmessage client (using bitchan and JXcore maybe) and a Docker container including Bitmessage client with API enabled for platforms not supported by Cordova and JXcore (or those who don't want to drain their mobile data plan).
The option of including a third party routing system for the driver might be considered (MapBox or similar).
So, what do you think; is Bitmessage a suitable platform to base our app on? Anything we're doing wrong or any other thoughts?
Thanks for your time and insight.
Best wishes, the MiceEatCheese
Edit typo; rename to Flash, fix links, add examples
submitted by MiceEatCheeseCo to bitmessage [link] [comments]

Log of AMA with bitbay.market - @dzimbeck (David Zimbeck), @Munti (Bjørn Alsos)

dr10 Let us all welcome team from :bitbay: bitbay.market :bitbay: - @dzimbeck (David zimbeck ) and @Munti (Bjørn Alsos). You can all start asking them questions. I'd ask team from bitbay.market to use @ username to the one they are responding to and I'd like to ask all the community to give them some time to catch up if too many questions in backlog, before asking more so questions don't get lost. Thank you!
dzimbeck Hi
dr10 Hello
Munti Hi
dzimbeck Wow you guys have quite the slack. 7k people
dzimbeck very professional site too, always noticed that
dr10 haha, yeah grew a bit over time
dzimbeck Also a decent domain.
arigard @dzimbeck Man, I remember you from back in the day in Blackcoin
dzimbeck Haha yes that is where I started
dr10 okay guys, start with your questions :wink:
Munti Is there anyone helping us keep track of any questions we might miss because we are busy answering?
dzimbeck But I'm not the dev of Blackcoin
dzimbeck I only wrote Halo into it because I needed an alt
dr10 I have an eye on the chat and people notice when you didnt answer it, dont worry :smile:
dzimbeck and didn't want to start a pump thing
tranzer What is BitBay in few words. Are you anonymous marketplace? (edited)
dzimbeck Unbreakable contracts, Anonymous serverless markets and rolling peg
dzimbeck all of those features are extremely important for decentralization and computer science in general
dzimbeck "Unbreakable contracts" is the non-technical term for "Double deposit escrow"
dzimbeck It works by both parties placing a deposit in a joint account
dzimbeck and if they cheat each other they both lose their funds when the time limit expires
dzimbeck making the contract somewhat unbreakable
dzimbeck regardless of what is agreed to
btcmacroecon what if one cheats the other?
dzimbeck since it's a joint account
btcmacroecon hunt them down?
dzimbeck you need that person to sign off
dzimbeck so they lose money
dzimbeck they can't cheat you
dzimbeck example:
dzimbeck you want to buy a guitar
dzimbeck which costs 100 dollars
dzimbeck so you put up a deposit of 100 and also 100 into the joint account
dzimbeck the seller also puts up 100 to guarantee shipping and their own honesty
dzimbeck when the seller sends the guitar if you steal it
dzimbeck then seller won't sign off on the contract
dzimbeck causing both parties to lose money
dzimbeck (you just paid 200 for a 100 dollar it)
dzimbeck So this forces users to work together
dzimbeck better than E-bay with arbiters
dzimbeck in fact.. I am shocked this isn't the industry standard
tranzer Are there any limits on how much can someone sell or buy item for?
dzimbeck I've been doing this for 4 years since BitHalo started
Munti When you use double deposit escrow, your protection is based upon the fact that no one can gain anything by breaking the deal. That pretty much eliminates scammers as there is no incentive for them.
btcmacroecon what if the seller "says" the other stole the guitar, when in reality it was received, it's jus seller wont sign off on it to be a dick
dzimbeck No limits
dzimbeck and deposits are negotiable (edited)
donze Nice idea
ulyssessyoungo interesting
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon Because the seller will lose money if he does
Munti I actually just bought a property in our marketplace. Got the paperwork in the mail today
donze Your market is active?
dzimbeck Being a dick doesn't profit a dime
donze Or work in progress
dzimbeck It actually costs money to be a dick
dzimbeck which is what we WANT
arigard @dzimbeck is that similar to the two way mad escrow Particl are working on?
ulyssessyoungo I like the sound of that
dzimbeck we want jerks to be broke
dzimbeck we want politicians to be the ones begging for food on the street
ulyssessyoungo do you have any system beyond that
Munti Our marketplace has been operational since early 2015
ulyssessyoungo to see if people honor the contracts?
ulyssessyoungo like user history or something
dzimbeck Oh there is tons of systems in BitBay
little_round Particl took it from bitbay
dzimbeck we actually have a wall of features
ulyssessyoungo I mean like
ulyssessyoungo say a guy has a history of blowing up contracts
dzimbeck http://bitbay.market/wall
ulyssessyoungo are those people easily identified as bad business?
tranzer Do you have numbers of how many people "were dicks" and how much was already agreed upon in your marketplace (like yearly turnaround)?
dzimbeck Yes
dzimbeck You can see how many contracts their profile has blown up
dzimbeck so you can mathematically calculate what their deposit should be!
dzimbeck It's like the perfect escrow for p2p transactions
ulyssessyoungo that's nice
Munti Actually particl (then shadowcoin) tried to hire David to make the marketplace for them many years ago. When he declined, they tried to revers enginer his code. They failed :slightly_smiling_face:
ulyssessyoungo So like a reputation system?
ulyssessyoungo I always check vendor reputations on alibaba, amazon etc.
arigard @Munti really? Interesting..
dzimbeck And it's been working for 3+ years it was actually the worlds first smart contracts
dzimbeck Yep
btcmacroecon is there a scenario when a seller would lose money if it harmed the buyer, even if seller loses money, adversely affecting the buyer, even if guitar received, to cause buyer to lose money? Or woul buyer come out ahead cause of guitar, or would that mean net loss for buyer in this scenario, despite "seller wouldn't do it cause he loses money assumption"
dzimbeck we have a reputation system
dzimbeck Yes you are right
dzimbeck but consider this @btcmacroecon
shtand Does the seller always match 100% of the value of what they're selling?
dzimbeck The seller does cause buyer to lose
dzimbeck but now they have proof they are blowing up contracts
dzimbeck who would want to work with that seller later?
dzimbeck Also that seller would be asked in future deals for a LARGER deposit
btcmacroecon ok and ebay has good marketplace for reputation.
dzimbeck meaning being a jerk is progressive;y cost inhibitive
dzimbeck And this reputation system there is no way to lie about it
Munti @dzimbeck I just noticed we both forget to use @ to make it clear who we are answering
dzimbeck because there is cryptographic proof you blew up the funds
btcmacroecon ok good to wait for established track record
dzimbeck I will use the @ more thanks
dzimbeck @shtand Not always
ulyssessyoungo eBay is good with the reputation system but not so much the arbitration
ulyssessyoungo so that makes me interested in alternatives
dzimbeck matching 1:1 is a great way to deal with strangers you don't trust
dzimbeck But a great seller might only put up 10%
ulyssessyoungo i've been screwed selling some high ticket items on ebay before, not terribly so but enough to make me wonder what the point of a middleman is if they just side with the buyer in most cases
dzimbeck exactly!!
donze safex will be full anonymous and will give dividends to those who own it, what are the advantages of bitbay other than being ahead in the roadmap?
dzimbeck But guys this isn't just buying and selling
dzimbeck who here has outsourced?
btcmacroecon What about where damage or not represented product as advertised? same thing? comes down to reputation scores?
dzimbeck @donze that would be the rolling peg we will get to that
arigard Does Bitbay have any anon functionality?
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon Realize a seller loses funds for damaged items if blown up. He will be much more motivated to work with buyer than he would be in e-bay
dzimbeck BitBays markets are anon
Munti @ donze If safex is able to pay dividends, they will need to take that money from somewhere. Fees? We have no fees (edited)
dzimbeck because they use Bitmessage
dzimbeck and we don't bloat the blockchain
dzimbeck because Bitmessage is p2p
dzimbeck and no chain is used
shtand what's determining who a 'great seller' is and what % they need to match then?
dzimbeck thus no servers
kimchi ...where does bitbay profit come from?
tranzer How is BitBay team being funded?
dzimbeck sender is hidden because messages are passed around making it hard to find the origin
dzimbeck decoding messages is plausible deniability because nobody knows if you have decryption key
dzimbeck (a market is a shared key)
dzimbeck @shtand A great seller would be someone with tons of contracts that didn't blow up
RQDxRocket joined #trading_altcoins.
arigard What about transactions, are they hidden too?
Munti @kimchi BitBay in itself does not need profit. The holders of the coin will get their profit from higher value because we gain adoption. and we are years ahead in this race, so should have a decent chance to increase price a lot
dzimbeck @kimchi I don't profit much from BitBay. We are mostly self funded
moon joined #trading_altcoins.
ulyssessyoungo Yeah it's not a centralized service so i don't see why it would need "profit" given that it's just a network
btcmacroecon does bitbay have any interest in their service being used with other projects to form a marketplace? any room for collaboration if buyers / sellers can be rounded up for establishing marketplace, reputation, including commodity trading?
ulyssessyoungo BAY is POS right?
tranzer Is BitBay POS or mineable or what consensus algo does it use?
dzimbeck @arigard Transactions aren't anon
dzimbeck but I'm a big ffan of zero knowledge proofs
dzimbeck There is ways to hide the person broadcasting using Bitmessage
dzimbeck but I haven't implemented
dzimbeck I'm a purist so if an anon route is chosen later then it will be on a very high level
arigard Will you be looking to do those kinds of things in the future? Maybe something like Zerocoin etc?
dzimbeck @tranzer POS
kimchi When can I see the beta version?
Munti @kimchi Also, Double deposit escrow ties up a lot of money, so when marketplace becomes really active , that will have tremendous impact on coin supply (reduced supply because of DDE). An average daily turnover on our marketplace of 1k dollars can create demand for as much as 30k-50k dollars worth of Bay (edited)
dzimbeck Maybe a side chain arigard
dzimbeck Since the main chain doesn't need to be anon
dzimbeck also anon would interfere with the rolling peg
dzimbeck Jesus zero proof:heart_eyes:
dzimbeck depending on what i choose for it
donze What is actual year trade volume of bitbay?
Munti @btcmacroecon BitBay is open for working with partners
dzimbeck @ulyssessyoungo yeah profit from escrow is not wise since it eliminates the middle man, we would not want the liability
dzimbeck also I meant to say earlier
dzimbeck these contracts work with employees too
dzimbeck so an employee is forced to honor his/her word
dzimbeck and employer is forced to pay
dzimbeck so no more unreliable outsourcers
Munti @donze Trade volume varies a lot like it does for most coins
dzimbeck It's been over a million a lot
btcmacroecon what do you think about creating a trading floor for commodities, or whatever "product" or "service" say "electronics" or "beer" or "metals"
dzimbeck but then it goes down to 50-500k
dzimbeck We don't fake our volume
dzimbeck :smile:
dzimbeck that is why, this is a very organic project
dzimbeck You see I used to be BitHalo
dzimbeck which was years before Ethereum
dzimbeck and was hired on to the BitBay project, the people who hired me disappeared
dzimbeck so the community and myself took it over
dzimbeck making it pretty organic
ulyssessyoungo I have been in your Slack for some time, i can vouch that you guys seem to be one of the more transparent teams.
Munti @btcmacroecon We already kind of have a trading floor for commodities. We have a fully working marketplace. In one of the comming updates we will also add templates for auctions.
dzimbeck BitHalo is still active but it's worth pointing out that all new templates and features will be withheld from BitHalo to give BitBay maximum impact
Bitbay1 uploaded this image: m2.jpg 1 Comment
btcmacroecon i like the concept and not of ebay as a seller given their fees, or as a buyer with paypal.
ulyssessyoungo lol those boots
dzimbeck Ebays biggest problem is scam buyers
dzimbeck no way to stop it
dzimbeck In our platform that is not going to happen
dzimbeck And let me stress something else
dzimbeck This is Bitcoin
dzimbeck which is anonymous
dzimbeck so scams are more prevalent
dzimbeck which is why it shocks me
dzimbeck that this isn't the industry standard for escrow
btcmacroecon but the man is wise
dzimbeck Plus we don't have to deal with arbiters
dzimbeck the analogy is you go to court... would you trust 12 peers and a judge to decide your fate?
dzimbeck I wouldn't
dzimbeck A witness where it's your word against theirs
dzimbeck This is a better system. There is no judge
dzimbeck just perp and victim
btcmacroecon i havent been to court once where the truth was spoken
dzimbeck empowering victims a little bit more
dzimbeck "instant karma"
dzimbeck That is exactly why I made this
btcmacroecon i had proof attorney was lying but judge refused to let me play it as i ha proo
dzimbeck Oh jesus
dzimbeck that sucks
btcmacroecon i was going to hit play in courtroom but she freaked out on the bench said i would not play it in her courtroom!
V01D Would there be any backlash against the name bitbay in the future if a company like eBay felt threatened?
dzimbeck Yeah also realize that losing a deposit makes a victim feel like the person who screwed them paid for it
btcmacroecon protected the liar
dzimbeck I don't think so but we can always rebrand
dzimbeck there is an exchange called BitBay too
dzimbeck timing was almost the same as ours
btcmacroecon 591 price on bay on bittrex
dzimbeck we had an international presence first
dzimbeck As for price
Munti @VO1D I don't see how ebay could do something about that. But then I'm not a lawyer
dzimbeck This IS a trading channel
V01D I see, thank you
dzimbeck we should talk about the rolling peg
btcmacroecon i sold all bay at 860
dzimbeck So when the project started I wasn't the founder
btcmacroecon pissed i could have got 870
dzimbeck so I knew there had to be a way to protect investors in case something bad happened
Munti LOL
dzimbeck So the rolling peg was designed
dzimbeck similar to an economic crawling peg
dzimbeck The way it works is this: we can control the supply of the coin by simply freezing it
dzimbeck so as most coins only inflate
dzimbeck this coin does both
dzimbeck it inflates and deflates
yin :open_mouth:
dzimbeck but it only freezes the coins temporarily to stop dumps on the market
dzimbeck and it does so exactly fairly
codnose It's been a bad 24 hours for lots of alts. It will bounce back @btcmacroecon ;)
dzimbeck coins have memory in this system so each coin knows it's own liquidity
funkedelics proof to back up your claim? Munti Actually particl (then shadowcoin) tried to hire David to make the marketplace for them many years ago. When he declined, they tried to revers enginer his code. They failed :slightly_smiling_face: Posted in #trading_altcoinsToday at 7:09 PM
dzimbeck reddit
btcmacroecon yah i hope to reposition on this coin as we speak
codnose Good few days for bay recently. I'm holding since a while back
dzimbeck there is proof where I fought with veritasBS from ShadowCash
dzimbeck They tried to reverse my code
Bitbay1 Freezing via decentralized voting?
dzimbeck it was famous
funkedelics link?
Munti @funkedelics On reddit as David said. I'm sure we can find a link for you after this session is over
dzimbeck Someone else can find it
dzimbeck @funkedelics
dzimbeck It is on the blackcoin subreddit
btcmacroecon what are you doing to avoid illegal activity, kyc, and silk road activity?
dzimbeck if you wanna look
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon I have a mod key which users subscribe to
dzimbeck which is handed out
dzimbeck so decentralized mod i guess
dzimbeck also users encrypt their IP within their orders
dzimbeck so if for some reason a swat team shows up at my house I just tell them they are free to use it
kimchi What is the return or refund?..
dzimbeck In theory we shouldn't need to deal with silk road type problems
btcmacroecon id say get a fkn warrant, shut the door
dzimbeck since we don't host anything
dzimbeck That too
codnose Rolling peg sounds very interesting. Is there a link here?
dzimbeck But we don't live in a fair world @btcmacroecon
dzimbeck USA arrested a guy in Greece who was a Russian citizen
dzimbeck nonsense
btcmacroecon and those that vote i big corrupt government blame trump
dzimbeck https://bitbay.market/about/pegging/ BitBay Rolling Peg - BitBay Price volatility is cryptocurrency's biggest challenge - BitBay's rolling peg will reduce volatility by dynamically controlling supply. Learn more here.
dzimbeck Never blame Trump
dzimbeck blame military intelligence
dzimbeck and compartmentalization
Munti @codnose our site is going through a little redesign atm, but the info on the rolling peg will be back up soon
btcmacroecon new vorld odor! I blame "globalism"
imyb commented on Bitbay1’s file m2.jpg Is this really what it's going to look like?
dzimbeck :smile:
codnose Great thanks @Munti
Munti LOL, it was back up (edited)
dzimbeck well whatever powerful people do
dzimbeck it's our job to come up with solutions like unbreakable contracts
dzimbeck these contracts work in an anarchy
dzimbeck literally
dzimbeck The rolling peg is meant to allow low cap coins
dzimbeck to thrive
little_round @imyb No, it will be changed
dzimbeck because the control of supply lets us force the price
dzimbeck by voting on supply
yin damn your product sounds awesome! but you need a redesign of your website :smile:
dzimbeck so example
btcmacroecon so you in essence have a dashboard already active.
dzimbeck if a user has 1000 coins at 100% at .10 cents per coin
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dzimbeck and the network deflates to 50%
dzimbeck he would have 500 coins liquid and 500 frozen
Munti @btcmacroecon What do you mean by dashboard?
dzimbeck he can move the liquid coins as much as he wants
btcmacroecon you have a marketplace or dashboard like ebay has basically?
dzimbeck the frozen coins he can move but with a penalty a one month delay
Munti @btcmacroecon Yes (edited)
dzimbeck which makes a secondary market for trading frozen coins
codnose Like the eBay dashboard right @btcmacroecon ?
dzimbeck at a more speculative value
btcmacroecon you just need to expand on it with volume
Bitbay1 https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9hEpu8gZMzEcP22rMYX0Iw/videos YouTube BitBay Official BitBay youtube channel
dzimbeck we can assume his liquid coins would be worth about double than before if demand is about the same
btcmacroecon do you offer any affiliate programs to market for that volume?
dzimbeck Good idea
dzimbeck @btcmacroecon Working on that now
dzimbeck We have just started discussions about incentives
dzimbeck @kimchi please elaborate
dzimbeck return or refund on what?
kimchi I bought shoes. But what if a brick comes? There is an image on top that sells shoes.
dzimbeck Then seller would pay 100 dollars
dzimbeck if you blow it up
dzimbeck so negotiate a refund
dzimbeck the seller will most definitely reconsider
dzimbeck since he doesn't want to pay 100 dollars to be a joker
dzimbeck You can cancel contracts
dzimbeck returning all funds
Anoeng joined #trading_altcoins.
dzimbeck upon mutual consent
dzimbeck everything is consent
btcmacroecon does bitbay have the ability to accept payment in a variety of cryptocurrency? I think that's where volume could come in, or a gateway to exchange tokens and buyer / seller can arrive at payment and yet can be worked via bitbay smart contract or escrowing? could that work, is it possible, if not care to explore it?
dzimbeck the way a contract should be
dzimbeck Yes
codnose Ha that's awesome actually. Why would a seller send anything else knowing they'd lose their deposit ?
dzimbeck You can use Ark to pay
dzimbeck Bay is only used as a deposit
dzimbeck you might have to specify the coins you would accept in your contract
ulyssessyoungo nice
ulyssessyoungo i like that
btcmacroecon and what about dogecoin for example?
codnose Yeah that's cool
ulyssessyoungo Definitely adds to the viability of the platform
codnose Whatcoin? Lol
dzimbeck yeah codnose it forces honesty
dzimbeck and the same for employees
Munti @btcmacroecon Also, our platform is very broad. You can use it for almost anything. We already had all kinds of things sold there from pins to property. Many coins have also been sold there. Our market is like an improved localbitcoin. Binary opptions is also you can find on our marketoplace regularly. And I'm sure we havent even scrathced the surface yet. In the future we will have API's so ppl can tailor their own version of our marketplace.
dzimbeck if I hire someone using this system
btcmacroecon ok deposit only, making more sense now
ulyssessyoungo BAY as a currency would certainly take off best after the Rolling Peg
dzimbeck they better do what they say
ulyssessyoungo but in the meantime that's awesome that you can use other coins
dzimbeck I actually used to it motivate myself
Bitbay1 Why not sell Ark for Bay on the market :slightly_smiling_face:
Bitbay1 or Btc
dzimbeck had my friend blow up my money if I didn't do my daily errands
dzimbeck imagine having 10 grand deterrent
dzimbeck :smile:
bivins Greetings
dzimbeck You can trade coins on the market
dzimbeck especially microtrade
codnose You bought some land using this you said @Munti ?
dzimbeck but it is slow
dzimbeck for that I recommend atomic trade
dzimbeck It's not that fast paced trading that traders demand...
dzimbeck but
codnose No worries about losing any money ? I take it it wasn't just a few dollars
dzimbeck Someone did sell IOTA on our platform
dzimbeck and did lots of deals
Bitbay1 yes before IOTA came into the exchanges
Munti @codnose Yes I did. Got the paperwork in the mail today. 5 acres of land in California. (And I live in Norway) (edited)
prasanth can we stake coins in the market client??
Munti Yes
dzimbeck Staking is done using 2 keys
dzimbeck so you can actually stake over LAN too
tranzer Could BitBay somehow bridge with Ark and offer their services to Ark users?
dzimbeck using 2 computers
dzimbeck it's called "cold staking"
dzimbeck no hacking is possible here
dzimbeck ever
dzimbeck you can hide keys in images
btcmacroecon ok i admit failure on setting up CoinURL as I tried to set up online store, to sell some code, my wildlife photography, and rocks and gems I prospect, I'd like to set up BitBay on an Iframe into my site, and capture affiliate biz. Sounds like this is almost possible, and I could sell my jade right through my site, at least offer it up, right?
dzimbeck and have dual passwords and use 2 computers to sign transactions automated
Munti @tranzer We would have to look into that. But I don't see any reason why we could not.
dzimbeck We need a web wallet
dzimbeck that is our biggest challenge
dzimbeck since I made this with a "security first" attitude
dzimbeck being a cryptographer (edited)
dzimbeck I forgot the reason to make everything web based
Munti @btcmacroecon We are not quite there yet, but yes, that's where we're going
dzimbeck Didn't want to sacrifice security
dzimbeck now I realize there is a need for web based platforms
codnose I follow you on twitter and saw that mentioned the other day. It's coming soon? @dzimbeck
dzimbeck that sacrifice a little security for speed and ease of use in phones
dzimbeck A web wallet?
codnose Yeah
dzimbeck Yeah well we will have a basic web wallet very soon
dzimbeck its actually a very nice one (edited)
dzimbeck But I was referring to a market wallet
dzimbeck one with the full contract implementation
dzimbeck we hope to do that after the peg is successful
Munti Keep an eye on our next weekly update (sunday) for roadmap for the rest of this year. You will get details there
dzimbeck since it's more important to deliver on what I promise
dzimbeck than to make up new features
dzimbeck aka "scope creep" a programmers worst enemy
mergatroid Hello
dzimbeck Hi
mergatroid Please comment on recent news around SEC delistings on bittrex - what steps are you taking to communicate with user base as to whether your a security and what you plan to do if you are classified as such
dzimbeck The rolling peg is the priority
dzimbeck Since Tether is unreliable
dzimbeck this is a decentralized peg
dzimbeck that isn't fixed at a certain price
dzimbeck so it can "roll" the price up
codnose Sounds like you have a lot of nice things planned :)
dzimbeck so it starts at say 5 cents
dzimbeck and slowly rolls up to 10 cents
dzimbeck over X amount of time
dzimbeck after that we would love to focus on web implementations
dzimbeck however anyone who wants to plug this into their site should contact us, we can set up some API calls for sure
Munti @mergatroid I just became aware of the SEC issue on Bittrex today, and have not had time to study it. But going by the little I did read, it doesn't seem to be a problem for us.
mergatroid Ok - so no plan so far understand
dzimbeck we aren't a security
dzimbeck because we don't pay dividends
mergatroid Thankyou
codnose Just on your website now @dzimbeck @Munti
dr10 OK we are approaching 1 hour mark. If you guys have any questions left, go ahead. Anything bitbay.market team would like to add or tell - feel free to do.
V01D Thanks for your time bitbay team
dzimbeck Thanks for doing this! It was fun. And maybe I have a few questions about Ark later
dzimbeck :slightly_smiling_face:
codnose Looking good. Thanks for stopping by :)
dzimbeck Any other questions?
dzimbeck Perhaps regarding the peg, contracts or markets?
Boris Is dzimbeck a god?
dzimbeck :smile:
dzimbeck no
dzimbeck I bleed
codnose Haha I'd heard that too
codnose At least in coding terms lol
dr10 Thank you David and Bjørn for taking the time to do this AMA! All the best with the project and you are always welcome to hang around our Slack
Munti If anyone wants more info, you are welcome to our slack http://bitbay.market/wp-login.php?action=slack-invitation
dzimbeck Honestly a little bit of effort is all these things take
dzimbeck Thanks dr10
Munti Thanks for having us. This was fun
submitted by Dr10tv to ArkEcosystem [link] [comments]

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